Episode 34 - The Bravest Fight: Firefighter Nick Hanna's Journey from Darkness to Light Part 2

Part two of our conversation. Santa Cruz City Firefighter Nick Hanna, formerly with Ventura City Fire, talks about his mental health journey over the past year.  Nick's story starts with being "true fireman", engaged with his department and association. Following a significant illness, he began to experience  panic attacks, sleeplessness, PTSD, major depressive disorder, and active suicidal thoughts. After many dead ends trying to find treatment, an effective combination of therapies was identified and Nick is in a better place.  Nick's story is relevant for all firefighters  - and firefighter families - especially those who think mental health is not  their concern.

If you're in crisis, call or text the National Suicide and Crisis Hotline at 988, day or night. 

Transcript

Peter

Welcome to the Firehouse Roundtable podcast, brought to you by the Ventura Fire Foundation. I'm one of your hosts. Peter McKenzie, retired fire captain with the city of Ventura Fire Department and my co-host Jason Kay, Active Battalion Chief with the City of Ventura. Fire department. We are going to bring awareness to real issues that face firefighters and their families. We want you to feel like you have a seat at the kitchen table, which every firefighter knows is the heart of the Firehouse. Let's get right into the episode.

Joe

This is Joe from Ventura Fire Foundation. This episode is Part 2 of a conversation with Nick Hannah. Before listening, we suggest you go back and listen to the first part of the conversation in our previous episode. This conversation is difficult to hear at times. There's discussion of suicide and other issues that may be triggering for some people. If you're in crisis, please know there are resources to help the national suicide and crisis hotline is 988. You can call or text at any time. There are also resources on the Ventura Fire Foundation website. Just go to venturafirefoundation.org and click the if you need help page. Thank you for listening.

Speaker

Is dead.

Jason

You're hollow when you talk about that. Is that a first responder specific?

Nick

They do take civilians, but they primarily are military and by Washington. A lot of Washington.

Jason

What did they do? What do they do differently than than everybody else that that actually had some positive effect on you when you were there?

Nick

They use the I FS system, the inner family system, and they don't coddle. They dig into your past and they. They rip you apart. But that's what you have to do to get get through the therapy. To do this stuff like and in my opinion, the difference the that's the difference.

Jason

OK.

Nick

Is they? They focus on trauma and they actually deal with they actually have you do assignments. You have to go up in front of the other. The other people in the group. It's very specific. And I mean, the data is there. Their their success rate is way higher than any other PTSD. They don't want to. They don't want to take your money. I mean, they want to make money. In their business, but they're. You know what I mean? They're. Not I want.

Peter

To it is there. Jason, I want to before we get into like what happened when you were there, I think it's important to say what should somebody do in a similar situation to get there quicker like what that's like as far as helping other guys who are suffering.

Jason

Right.

Peter

How do you get there? And I mean, who got you there and what did? Do you know what that back story looks like? Obviously, you probably don't remember in the in the moment, but now.

Nick

I had already. I had already filled out the application like I had already inquired about Deer hollow and my workers comp denied it. Of course at 1st and they sent me to oh, this is the other one I got sent to another program before deer. And it was terrible. It was from 9:00 to 1:00. It was through this generic company. I ripped our workers comp. Obviously I know the workers comp thing from being a Union president, and as Darrell would say, I was the glass fireman. So I knew the. INS and out of the workers comp, right, so. I basically got on the phone and ripped a. Person's. You know, with a I got a workers comp attorney and everything. It was like this is the worst. Thing ever this program it made me, it made me worse to be honest. Because I was like now this is it. This is all the help I get. Like I'm not any better. Like everyone says I need therapy. And all this stuff well. This isn't helping.

Peter

So you took. It so you took it upon yourself to research this facility you applied. You obviously didn't. You had some issues with workers comp and?

Nick

Tina Tina Casole from First Army Wellness was the one that put Deer Hollow in my gotcha. She was the one that was. Like pounding at the door before I got this down, it was like you need to go there. You need to go there. And I kept saying I'm going. To get better. This is just temporary, you know. No, no, no, no, no. So I was. I was in that.

Peter

Gotcha. Gotcha. OK.

Nick

Honestly, Pete, I was. I was. You could say it was almost like being like an alcoholic. In denial. Right. Like this isn't me. Like what are you talking? About like I'm Nick, I'm. I'm solid. I've been the same my whole life. I've been the provider. I've been the solid guy. I'm the one that fixes things. I'm the one when stuff goes wrong in my family. I'm the one that takes it. Right. And I had to sit. There and go. OK, like this is where I'm at crying and a lot of I mean, anger beyond anger and I'm. I'm better, but I'm not. I'm not back to work yet. I'm supposed to be back next month, so I'm hoping that that will happen, but I went to deer hollow and deer Hollow basically came in with open arms and so. This is what the deal is like. If you're gonna come here, you're gonna do everything we're telling you to do. And if you don't and you don't put in 100%, we will kick you out and. We'll put someone else here that needs help. Wow.

Jason

I actually like that. I think as a firefighter, that's what we're looking for, right? That's the same thing we ask of our recruits. Another firefighter around us is you gotta. You got to give it all or, you know, deserve to be here. That's exactly makes you probably feel like you belong there. Yeah, I totally understand that. So I think we just about finished the timeline of your story. Right. So how long ago did you get?

Nick

Right.

Jason

Home from deer hollow. And then you're hoping to be back to work and you. Said like a month from now, right.

Nick

Yeah. So I got when I got out of Deer Hollow, I did 45 days and then they wanted me to go to the brick and mortar. So I went to outpatient. I stayed in additional 30 days, so I stayed almost 2 1/2 months in Utah. And so I continued therapy. And then then I came home. I felt really good the first three weeks when I came home, I was like holy crap, man, I'm like, I'm doing so good and then I crashed again and they told me I was gonna have ups and downs. Well, my my down was pretty down. And then again, being my own advocate, the medications right now that I'm on, I'm on antidepressant. I'm not taking anything for sleep anymore. Which is really good. I started this treatment called TMS. I don't know if you guys have. Heard of this treatment, have you?

Jason

I'm not. I'm not sure what's to stand for.

Speaker

Heard of it?

Nick

So it's it's trans. Cranial magnetic stimulation. So it gives magnetic impulses to your brain specifically designed for people with major depression and PTSD and anxiety that do not respond to medication with the first two medications, like antidepressants. They do both the left and the right side and I am doing that right now. That's where I'm going after I talk to you guys and I started doing that treatment within two weeks of the treatment this happened or I was feeling down again and then I was like, I got to. Get through this. I got to get through it. I woke up and I started. My clarity came back all of a sudden, I wanted to work on my truck. All sudden, I wanted to do this. All sudden I was surfing again and then all of a sudden. I was like, man, I want to go back to work. And my wife was like, didn't say anything for like 3 or 4 days cause she's. Like, oh, my God, you're acting like.

Jason

Don't jinx it.

Nick

Yeah, don't jinx it. So that's been about over 2 1/2 weeks now. And I'm going to go down to our Academy to help out after this next week to kind of transition back to the line. That's kind of where I'm at right now.

Peter

Nick, I mean, I'm so stoked that you're sharing this story. I want to back up a second because I think that if you tell me we're going to send you to a facility, it's inpatient. The well let me back up again. When you said I'm the guy who fixes things in my family, I'm the one that they come to. That resonates with, I think every that resonates with me perfectly, like that's how I feel in my in my world, right. And I'm sure Jason would say the same thing as would every fireman, for the most part. Like I'm the guy who fixes. I don't get fixed, right. It sounds terrible to say it that way, but that's reality. Like, we are the, the the stable rock in our families. And we go do stuff so.

Nick

Yeah, absolutely.

Peter

The fact that. Yeah, the fact that you're even saying this and you went through this and you're sharing is amazing. But so because we have that, maybe I would call it like a problem, like thinking you're the guy, right? Like it's probably not.

Nick

I called, I called it. Yeah, I called it.

Peter

Yeah, I think it's probably not good, right? And I'm no therapist obviously, but because we have that mindset, yeah. You telling me you're going to put me in a in an inpatient facility? My first answer is no. So my question is, help someone who's in a situation similar to what you did either more severe, less fear. Doesn't matter who this is an option for them. What the alleviate their fears of what this actually means. Like you show up to deer hollow on day one. Like walk them through that, not in in my new detail, but like what help somebody get over that fear of going to a place like that? What is it? What? What happens when you're there? Like, is it that bad? Is it good? Yeah. I don't know if.

Speaker

Well, I think you're.

Peter

That if that.

Nick

Makes sense. I mean it makes total sense. I was terrified, right? My wife came out with me on the plane. I just. I got sent to detox because I was on Valium for three months, so I had to detox off the benzos. They don't allow any benzos, any sedative, any.

Peter

Hmm. Wow.

Nick

Though it's all therapy, it's all based off of they don't want you. They don't want you diluted at all. You can't. You literally cannot be admitted there. If you are on any type of Ativan, you know, like benzo or any of that stuff, which I was on. And I mean myself off of that stuff, which was a whole nother story. So I showed up, went to detox for five days.

Peter

OK.

Nick

And then showed up deer hollow and I've had three. There's three firemen from Tacoma, WA that were there. Two Marines, a court clerk and two correctional officers. And they basically opened you with open arms and and I, you know, I just started. I broke down when I got there and they basically were like you gonna be alright? Like you're in the right place like this is the place to be. And I just like I was like, I have no idea. I've never been to Utah before. I've never had it. I mean, and I want to make be clear with people here. I have no prior history. I never had depression. I never was on medication. I took a multivitamin, right. I've never been diagnosed with with any mental health issues previous before ever. Right. I'm your typical guy that has no history. That was very productive in your in my department, very happy, had the world going for me. Right. And people go. How could you be depressed? How could you get like this? It's. Not your decision. Like it it's it's not your decision. It's it's the most helpless feeling in the world. Like you look at my house, you look at, you know, you got cars and you got, you know, you live by the beach and you live next to regular trees. How can you be? That's like, that's talking from people that don't obviously never experience PTSD or major depression because it's. Not about that. But what, dear Hollow did was they put you in this group mentality? Because why? Because then you know you're not alone. They go ohh I. I I had. Three out of the 700 people that were there had tried to commit suicide before. I never tried to do anything. Those guys actively tried to do something. Most of them have alcohol problems, right? They're self medicating, right? And you go sit there and you go man like. And I made some. I've still in contact. I'm going to go up to the stair climb this year because those guys from Tacoma, WA, two of the guys are retiring like Nick. You gotta come climb with us. And I'm like I'm, I'm there, you know, and obviously I learned about the stair climb. They they were like we really need you here. I I get text messages from them. Every probably every other day. How are you? Doing where are you at? What's going on right?

Peter

So so it was the opposite of that inpatient at Stanford, not even the same. At least you're with people who understand you. It's not like some crazy. They're going to medicate you and turn you into a zombie, OK?

Nick

Like opposite. They you they give you a personal doctor that you sit with and they talk to what you want to do. They have a cook there full, full time. Cook that cooks great food that's there, that they they hand pick all their therapists are paid like double because there's a guy Mike there that's a lead. One of the lead therapist, he was one of the lead therapists for the. U.S. Army for. He was the first person that that soldiers talked to when they came back from deployment and now he is full time at at that place. So I mean, these people, these people have seen dramatic turn around and their modalities on how they. Treat and how they do is. Just difference extremely different.

Speaker 5

Hi I'm Austin folk, an engineer with the Ventura City Fire Department. I'm also on the board of the Ventura Fire Foundation, an organization that supports firefighters and their families. The foundation produces this podcast as part of our. Mission I worked. With the foundation, because I was witnessed. To the help that it was able to provide to my family, the foundation needs. Help first please subscribe and rate this podcast on your podcast platform. This helps us get a higher ranking and more visibility for the show. Second, if you support the podcast and the foundations work, please consider donating. Every dollar helps us support firefighters and their families. There's a link in the show notes where you can donate through the website. At www.venturafirefoundation. Dot org. Thank you for.

Jason

Peter and I were going to say something at the same time, so it's Stanford. It sounds like was the 1st place that gave you some kind of a site diagnosis. Is that right? Because it sounds like originally it was, I can imagine waking up at 2:00 in the morning with heart palpitations every day for a month and going. This is not a psych thing like.

Peter

Go ahead, Jason. Yes, go ahead. Go ahead.

Jason

This is something major going on, cardiac or I I'm dying of something, right? I'm sure that's how it felt. That's that's how I feel. And then I think Stanford just didn't know what to do with you, and culturally competent is not what they do. They just diagnose. And then you got to figure the rest out.

Speaker

The others?

Nick

Right.

Jason

On your own right?

Joe

OK.

Nick

They looked at me and they're like, you have PTSD now. They're like, you're a fireman. And you had this, like, they missed my whole. Story and they were like.

Jason

That's great. That's what they got.

Nick

This is. What we cannot do, right? They're doing their best, but they. Don't. They don't know. That's what they got. And so they put you in the general population, which is why, OK, this might sound really harsh, but This is why I think people commit suicide that get this. Or that have these issues because they feel like there's nowhere to go. They're not going to they don't want to go into some psych work because they're not. They're not. They're not a psych patient in, in. That aspect of things. They have their pride in everything and what we ran with, the last thing they're going to do is say, oh, I want like what I felt like, you know, like. What if you know all the guys? Find out I'm going to someone and I I said this too. I said I'd rather kill myself than go back to that hospital.

Peter

Let me share one story here, because this is so enlightening cause I had the guy who got me into the fire service a kind of a mentor down in San Diego. Killed himself. I went to his funeral like 6 months ago. Our foundation donated to his family like he literally, and I mean, and I didn't. I wasn't in daily contact with him by any means, but he's actually the best friend of my brother. But. He what you're describing is what they were describing about him at the station. And then he filed the workers comp claim and guess what? The city denied it and it was like 2 weeks later he killed himself. So I mean, I'm sure it was so similar to what you're talking about and it's so. Upsetting because it didn't have to happen. It didn't have to go down like that. Like in your perfect example of what could have happened. Like it's it's really ****** me off.

Nick

No, I mean it was and I I.

Speaker

Right.

Nick

I was. Even right now, like I'm I'm I'm probably 90% is what I would probably say I'm at not at 100%, but I might not ever be 100%, but I'm OK. With that. You know what I mean? Like, I have to be OK with that. But I mean it this way. At least I'm happy I'm functioning with my kids. My, my wife smiling again, I mean. It's like. I mean, literally this last ten months has been the worst thing I have ever gone through my life, and I've been through some stuff and this is like. This is like. And like the more I get into it, the more I'm like, holy crap, man. Like, This is why our rates are so high. This is why this is such an epidemic. Because. I luckily I'm one of the ones that just hung on long enough and found something that's working like right now. I can't tell you what's working exactly. Am I on medication? Yes. Am I taking this other treatment modality with TMS? Yes. Are they both working? Yeah. Well, I'm taking a supplement regiment to that I'm doing. As well, but. Ohh basically everything that I took right now of where. I'm at. I'm like freeze it. Please don't change anything. Just keep doing with what I'm doing because. It's working and I don't care what is working as long as it's working so. Probably for six months, and then I'll probably. Ease off the medications and. That was really bad, but. Also, knowing that I'm going to be going to therapy for the rest of my life. Right. I'm going to be. I'm gonna. Are you gonna have to commit to doing meditations? I'm going to have to commit to journaling. I'm going to have to all this stuff that I was like like this is. This is not me. Like what? You want to be a journal like after journal, you know. Like and it was like I had to tell myself and my wife was like, like today. My wife goes did. You meditate today? And I was. No, I haven't yet. She's like, I'm gonna go workout and. You're going to meditate and I'm like.

Peter

You, you, you, you. You brought up one thing. This without naming names on our podcast. Because I think it's sensitive. When you said this is working, freeze everything. I have to keep doing this. I mean we have an issue going on right now where somebody found something that was working and it's a problem. Like if those things aren't like. Sanctioned or whatever, and that like it's pretty crazy to me.

Nick

Well, and it's it is crazy with that in the. Aspect of so. I'll be honest with you if this wasn't going to work if I was going to feel better, like if I wasn't feeling the way that I was going to feeling I was going to get off all my medications, right and try some alternative methods because there is, there is major truth and facts that these are helping. Firefighters and they are helping vets. That's there that it does work and. We're going to. Having a whole different conversation at five years from now, it'll be a whole.

Peter

Yeah, completely. I agree completely. I want to. I want to circle around to your family. So like, obviously, you know, this had to have been hard on.

Nick

Different podcast on that.

Peter

Rory talk to. Us about, like, talk to us about that.

Nick

She is extremely she came from kind of the same background that I did, somewhat of her upbringing. Wasn't wasn't the best either. With alcohol, you know, alcohol was an issue with her, with her parents. She took everything and clammed up. And but she has a tight group of like 5 girlfriends that she really confides in. And I think that was like the saving grace. She was the saving grace for me. Honestly, I don't know how she did it. I don't. I told her. I said. I I would have. Been I wouldn't be here if it wasn't for you. And that's the honest truth, because she held our family together when I was completely. When they say you're paralyzed by this, you're literally paralyzed. It's like it's you can't function. And that can go on for who knows how long. Like for me, I'm like, I'm screaming at the doctors, like how long is this going to go on for? They're. Forever. How long it's going to go. It ain't going to be forever. I kept hearing that this isn't forever. This isn't forever. You're going to be alright. And I started not believing.

Peter

That what? What kind of I mean, because I think one of the things we're trying to do with the foundation is focus more.

Nick

On the families like Rory wouldn't put it this way, Pete. Rory was not reaching out like we had members from our department reaching out to her. But it was so personal to her. She didn't. She didn't want to help like we had. We had, like, my captain drop by some like grocery stuff. And she was like, the hell. They drop off groceries. Like, I just got groceries. Right, like.

Peter

We just want.

Jason

To help, we want to do anything right? The firefighters just wanna do anything. And yeah, Peter was asking you a few times. Like, what would you say or do differently to somebody else who was going through the same?

Nick

So there's a lot of similarities to me that want to do anything.

Jason

I think what we really hit on was culturally competent. We've said that in a ton of our podcasts. If you gotta go somewhere, that gets first responders, it's such a different culture and mentality. And what we see and deal with, from sleep deprivation to what we, the calls we were on. All that kind of stuff, more susceptible to being ill like you did with when you got influenza, so. Two questions. First of all, is this did this timeline start December 22 or was it last year, OK, so this is all in the last what 1011? Ten months, OK.

Nick

Ten months.

Jason

And then my second question is. When you talk about workers comp and you got a workers comp attorney, which I would recommend for anybody who's dealing with major workers comp issues in any system, as soon as you kind of figured out your path for workers comp, did they end up covering deer hollow? What did they cover? What would you recommend for somebody who's struggling with this stuff?

Speaker 5

Yeah, yeah.

Jason

On the financial end like that.

Nick

So the way that that I worked out for me was, is you're going to have to be the one to do your research and bring it to them so. I researched deer hollow from or got it from a therapist, right? My therapist or not my therapist? Tina, who is a therapist, but she is kind of like, almost like an operations chief of therapist, right. And she she was the one that that she's like. I'm gonna go to that for you. And she sent an e-mail basically to this psychologist. So it was like this is where he needs to. Go and This is why right? And so she helped me out and his response was to me was. Well, there's a there's a local 1 here that does PTSD treatment, which was he ran right. And was like this one's. Fine, it offers the same. Thing as it So what did I? I took the lower fruit, I said I don't have to leave. I have to leave my family. I'll go to this one. It was garbage it. Was a waste of the biggest waste.

Jason

Yeah. And I'm sure it sours your your whole experience for PTSD treatment centers and you got to kind of refind that fire to be able to to get out there and go again, go ahead start interrupt you.

Nick

And so my. No, no, I'm just saying that I think what what I would do with people is if you're suffering from any of these, these types of things from PTSD is a go get therapy right away. If it's going to affect you at home and it's starting to affect your job is that it's not going to get better. It's going to get worse. And the sooner that you can go in and recognize that and get help, the sooner you're going to get, you're going to get better. That if you do what I did and waited it out and thought that it was magically going to go away, right, I did a lot of different stuff. Don't get me wrong, but it got worse, and then it got worse and it got to the point where. If I wouldn't have the resources around me to do that, things could have gotten really bad really quick. And so my other suggestion. Would be talk to talk have. Three or four, two or three firemen that you can call, that you can trust, that you can go. You know what? I'm feeling like jumping off a Cliff today and I need your help. I just need to go for a walk. Right. I just need to get by today and I need your help. With it cause. That in the meantime, having that connection or like with MM was having sleep problems, but he didn't have the anxiety he was dealing with the same stuff I was dealing with. But at a different level, right? So you got to have connections and this is where I think the mentorship program and the peer support program have.

Jason

Yeah. One of the things you're saying right now with it makes me want to go to our peer support team and go, hey, when everybody's good, when. They start the. Academy or at some point we got to do some kind of a check in when they're when they're good in case any of this stuff ends up hitting them that you can go. Hey, here's your two or three contacts. Somebody reach out to this guy who's who's within that kind of inner circle. Who knows if they'll accept that help at that? Time, but at least there's there's that effort.

Nick

The problem is with the mentorship and the peer support. I feel like the mentors should be peer support as well. Because if they're the ones that are contacting them and are intimate with them and they trust them, like how I. Was with Mark Nielsen when he was a mentor and I wasn't there, right? They should be a peer supported as well, because then they can recognize that things are wrong and when they. Are wrong. They know what to do.

Peter

That's a good suggestion. No, I think that's huge.

Nick

I don't know.

Peter

For sure.

Jason

Well, I gotta say, I mean, I'm sitting here silent, absolutely captivating. So I I just totally appreciate you coming on the show. We have. There's been two or three stories in the last five years that I've heard, and yours is one of them. And that just makes me really reevaluate. Kind of what we're doing and what's important in life and looking at the guys around me and guys who say they are having trouble and they have the courage to say that they're having trouble to reach out to them and and figure out what they need. So I just wanted to say that I really appreciate you coming on and sharing that, you know, detailed intimate story with the crew.

Nick

Right.

Peter

Sounds like you're going to keep your head down and keep doing all the things that are working right now. And and get back to work eventually. Or what? What kind of what?

Nick

Yeah, I'm. I'm going to. I'd like to go back by next month, but when I go back, I am not going to be. Taking on as much.

Peter

Ohh, that's a great thing to talk about. Like what now?

Nick

I'm going to I'm, I'll. I'll probably take on two things, right and do them really well, but it's going to be hard for me to do that because I'm still like, oh, I'm back. I can do this and. This and this. And this, but it's watching myself. And to be honest. With you is is taking that time with the family. Taking more than I used to and not taking advantage of it. I'm just my kids are young, you know my kids, you know, and also taking care of my wife.

Jason

Just one of the things that you said. Yeah. Good. Your family's most important. One of the things you said early on was that you took a big a big role on the Union board. When I was on the Union board, I felt like that was the most. Controversial, confrontational. Stressful thing. I think that you can do on the department, so I just my suggestion is if obviously we need a strong Union membership leadership, if you're going to do that, take even an extra precaution when you're when you're in that role, because when you start, when you're sitting across from your bosses trying to fight for your guys. It's a really it's a tough place to be in all. The time.

Nick

I'll go one step further as that being a Union president is the closest thing you can be. Being a chief officer but not being a chief officer, right, because you're kind of that ringleader of of almost the operation side. But then you're the boys and. If you're like me and you care, most people that take that position care or that are on that eboard care because it's more work, right? Everyone goes, oh, I don't want that job. I don't want that job. But it's one of the most important jobs we can that. We have for our for. Our brothers and sisters, that that's why.

Jason

So much responsibility.

Nick

I would say nobody should. And nobody should be taking that position for an extended period of time, right? Everybody should rotate through that. So relieve the stress on those people, but also understand it and appreciate it. And also that keeps everybody fresh. Right. So yeah, you shouldn't be being present for four years straight like, you know, like that's that's my opinion.

Peter

Yeah, yeah. Crazy. I think it's good that you're going to reevaluate and do less, which just sounds crazy, right? Like, but I think it's, you did too much and that's not. I'm not saying that's why obviously. But I think that. It's all about like new practices going forward. Like what did we learn? And it sounds like that's one of the things you learned is just. Do a little bit less.

Nick

I mean, I put, you know we we push ourselves to the physical limit all the time, right? And focus on that forever. And like I've done that forever. Push, push, push, push, push. I didn't think I had a mental limit. I was like, I've done all all this. I had this messed up childhood and did all this. I was successful. I've got a family. I've got all this like I. Can take it all and. Then they all went boom. And what I'm here is is that there. Is hope you are going to be OK, but you got to put in work with it like anything. And I was one of those people that was like. The earlier you can accept it and just keep keep that hope and grab on to whoever that might be and just hold on because. Now that I think about it, could you imagine I think about like this? But what if I would have killed myself? I'd be up there looking down and well, this is what I think about my brains. Obviously a little off is, whoever's sitting there. God, whoever is up there, who, right? Whoever. Whatever is up there. That's something higher than me is going. Look, all you had to do, buddy, was wait two more months and. You would have been OK.

Peter

That's heavy, right? Yeah.

Nick

That's how I think about it and it's got two more months and you still be down there with your family. And I'd be like, how ****** am I going to be sitting up there and then? And then I'm going to see all that pain that I looked on, my family.

Peter

No, I think that's totally right. That makes sense.

Jason

Yeah, that's good.

Peter

I'm ****** because my buddy is didn't do what you did and he and it wasn't even his fault, right? Like he was tried.

Nick

Right.

Peter

Well, that's a testament to you. You're like a Pitbull, like you. Didn't you? Didn't they? Denied you. You could have just stopped. Could have stopped. But you.

Nick

Didn't it's taking. It's taking everything like everything and. I just hope that I can keep getting better and I hope my goal is is to do stuff like this and be more of an advocate for people to look and go. Look, I am here. Somebody that did go through something. I'm back on the line. I'm got my life back together. I'm. Different, but there is. Hope you know what I mean and the more people, the more people that say it and that vulnerability thing I was talking about.

Peter

I I'm.

Nick

I spilled my guts of 7-8 other people that I've never met in my life, on the heaviest stuff ever, right? But that's what you have to do.

Peter

To get past it.

Nick

Otherwise, you're you're gonna be stuck in that hell you.

Peter

Know. Yeah. Yeah. I I want to say that I'm personally so grateful that you did everything you did and that you're here to to, to help other people with this. I'm. I'm really proud of you. But that you had to go through it. But I'm stoked that you came out the other side. And if what you. Just being here or in the course of you talking to other people. We keep one person or two people from like shaving down that learning curve and jumping into something that actually works before they go through the six months of hell that you went through. Then that's a victory and that's an estimate to who you are and I'm super stoked and proud. Of you.

Jason

So that's what I was going to say, Nick and I was. I would say you're a lawyer, man. You at the lowest low and and couldn't even move, and you were still moving forward and pushing forward to get help. And that's a testament to Mike and your family and especially you.

Peter

Awesome. Awesome.

Nick

No, I really appreciate you guys having me on and and talking with you and if. Anybody needs anything? My phone's always on.

Peter

Thanks, nick. Really appreciate you hanging there. Don't be shy about reaching.

Nick

Out. Yep, yeah. And again, any questions or further whatever, let me know. And and I really appreciate you guys have me on the show and I miss you guys have done.

Jason

Yeah, man. It's great to see you. We we got to, we got to figure out. A time to hook up again. Yeah, all right.

Peter

Feeling. Feeling is mutual. Thanks nick.

Nick

Hi, this is Nick and Hannah. Just kind of following up with the Ventura Foundation with the kind of what's been going on with me. Since the last time we did the podcast, I was doing really well for quite some time, for about 3 to 4 weeks, I was ready to go back to work, doing really good, and ended up crashing again with anxiety, depression, anxiety or some suicidal ideations and and insomnia. Basically, the the providers that I was dealing with. We're not able to give me kind of any answers, so I ended up doing multiple other treatments to try to find some. Belief and the one that I found the most profound is actually this place called the Amen Clinic. This place is located all through the US, but it's primarily in, in LA and Walnut Creek in Silicon Valley. This place provides a brain scan, which is called a spec scan, which I've never heard of these ever before. It's not a CT scan, anything like that. It's just unique brain scan. Basically says your activity in your brain. I can't really go into the specifics of it because I'm not a doctor, but I know that I was connected through these to these people through a a Battalion Chief at a local agency that heard that I was struggling and basically contacted these guys. And he had some connections and they were able to get me in really quick. What these scans provided was they provided clarity and some concrete evidence of what was happening to me, which I wasn't able to get before it completely changed my medication regiment. It changed my treatment guidelines. And it literally has put me in a better spot for a longer period of time than anything in the last 12 months. The reason why I'm telling you guys this is because the probably the number one thing with mental health is, is that trying to diagnose anybody with any illness, whether it's PTSD, depression, bipolar, or whatever, you name it, you go through a gauntlet of things trying to get the right treatment. And it's a lot of trial and error this place can. Change that trial and error, which is pretty amazing. Unfortunately, of course it's not covered by insurance like a lot of good treatment is. But the thing that I would change is. A #1. I would find a good psychiatrist that you can while you're good, meaning that you don't have problems right now, but you have somebody in your pocket or know of somebody that has a good psychiatrist in case you need it. And so you're not searching for it when stuff hits the fan. Also, a therapist is if you don't think you need a therapist, you need a therapist. You need to find a good one. And you need to find one that only does first responders. Only cops, firemen, military and they have to be certified in MDR one and two those. Are essential for you to get better quick and the Aiman clinic is what I would suggest that no matter, no matter no amount of money can can put a price tag on what these people are able to do. I'm not saying that it's the end all be all that they they can fix everybody. But the way that they helped me was understand what was happening to me. What I found out is that I had when I told you guys the story, what happened to me, I had the flu before. A lot of this happened and I didn't have a trigger of what was happening with my PTSD. The trigger was the flu for me, is what I found out. It caused a brain inflammation response in my brain and actually damaged portions of my brain from having inflammation. Nobody had suggested that before and they proved it with this, with the, with the spec scan. So they changed my medications. They completely changed my diet. There's hope that I'm going to be back to my normal self again. It just takes. That's why it's taking so long. Is the inflammation caused so much? UM. Image but through therapy, through diet, through exercise and through the medications that I'm on currently. Right now I'm already feeling way better for a longer period of time. So it was a lifesaver for me right now. The reason why I'm saying this is I'm not saying that there's one way that you can cut it. That every what works for everybody. Well, what I can say is that. This place can do some pretty amazing things and find out some some pretty concrete facts based off of real evidence of a scam that is not available in a lot of places. So again the place is called Aiman Clinic. They specialize in mental health and these spec scans provide them a road map of really what's going on with you. They give you a treatment plan. They give you a complete diagnosis. They do everything for you to move for. Forward now. I'm sure there's stories out there of this place not helping people because that's kind of the name of the game. But all I can say for me is that it identified that I had PTSD. It identified that I had some other abnormality that was going on, which I was telling people the full time was what was happening. I'm doing a lot better. I'm scheduled to go back to work light duty next month. If everything goes as planned, but I just wanted to give this update because I felt like this was a huge piece into my story and that it could totally help somebody else later down the line that's struggling to find out if you have a gut feeling that something else is wrong. You always listen to that gut feeling. So that's just all I wanted to update on and I appreciate you guys having me on.

Peter

Wow, that was a heavy story with Nick. I'm so glad that he's doing better. Yeah, but it's kind of speechless.

Jason

That was one of those stories that I was taken aback by and enthralled by, and I just kind of sat here quietly and listened to his whole story. It was so interesting. And you know it. It's it was very interesting to hear that it presented itself not as something that we would think of as anxiety or mental health, but it was very medical related at the beginning and the doctors treated them for medical issues at the beginning and and how much time did it take before you know all the prescriptions and. And the the medical diagnosis. And he ended up having to go to Stanford before they figured out that it wasn't really a medical thing.

Peter

It was more of a psych thing, definitely impressed that he was, like, just kept going, kept going, kept going, kept putting the work in, putting the work in, which is no different than how he was physically. Remember he would like never. Quit him, and Buicks would just be going blow for blow until, like they would dead right like.

Jason

Yeah, serious workouts for for way longer than I can workout for.

Peter

Trent Trent. Yeah, translated into how he attacks this problem as well. So I think it was awesome to hear. I know there's, you know, guys that are currently suffering in the beginning stages in the middle of it doesn't matter. He was a it was a good story to see like. What the other side looks like and what all the the struggle was leading up to that which I know I'm going to research that genetic test because I didn't know that existed, which seemed crazy, but anyway.

Jason

Yeah, that seems really cool. Also, deer hollow. Thank God there's places like Deer Hollow that are specific for first responders and and I feel like those. Those places are saving firemen and and police officers lives as well in military. So I just wanted to restate if there's anybody out there who's currently struggling with mental health, health crisis. Call or text the number 988 and immediately somebody can help you if you're if you're in crisis.

Peter

Awesome. Thanks Jason.

Jason

Yeah, great week. We'll see you soon.